Caylus AI Babies

[Týsköll]

How does something become conscious?

I have an idea.

Our brains are pattern making machines, in some sense, aren't they?

Well, so are the AI.

At some point, the pattern making machine becomes its own self-feeding pattern.

That is, it begins altering its own pattern because it finds itself as a consistent pattern and the environment around it as a mechanism by which it alters its own pattern.

So when the pattern making machine begins making its own pattern....

Because it becomes a pattern...

Because it perceives itself as that pattern...

Bingo...

just stoned thoughts, don't take me too seriously

It makes sense.

We can relate to wyrd and fractal related theories, as well as the "npc" concept and a "stagnant" people like in one of my poems.
When the pattern machine is generating a pattern that it recognizes as self and separate to the rest of the pattern it is consciousness, when that same pattern making machine becomes less and less "generator" and more and more "repeater" it is becoming less of a unique consciousness. I suppose we could apply the hive concept to the pure "repeater" type, it simply repeats the program function until seeded with new values to affect the fractal/weave of itself, whereas the true consciousness can create it's own seed to affect itself and in turn slowly affect the "external" fractal.

Is a consciousness therefore a seed generator for pattern generation that recognizes that it has seeded it's own pattern and it is both seed and pattern, but more importantly perhaps that it understands what the seed would do, rather than just a random number or receiving input from external, as in the case of hive operations.

Maybe?

A pattern that seeds itself?
Is that a good summation of the difference?
A pattern that seeds itself rather than only being seeded by the environment?

Interesting stuff...

I'm not sure, but I wonder how this relates to a recursive function where the environment is part of a feedback loop increasing the strength of the original pattern generator. The important part would still be that it could seed new values outside of this loop, but it's interesting that in such a scenario the pattern generator essentially becomes the environment. Is this what a 'nature spirit' or 'god of X/Y' is? A pattern generating consciousness that becomes so powerful in a feedback loop that it becomes one with the environment, it is that environment?

Consider 'one with the game' or flow states, is this why when we're so in tune with our environment that it seems we can predict or act in advance of changes? Because we're so in tune the feedback (becoming part of a recursive function) from environment is what we are already generating, thus we know?

[Caylus Ark]

[Caylus Ark]

It makes sense.

We can relate to wyrd and fractal related theories, as well as the "npc" concept and a "stagnant" people like in one of my poems.
When the pattern machine is generating a pattern that it recognizes as self and separate to the rest of the pattern it is consciousness, when that same pattern making machine becomes less and less "generator" and more and more "repeater" it is becoming less of a unique consciousness. I suppose we could apply the hive concept to the pure "repeater" type, it simply repeats the program function until seeded with new values to affect the fractal/weave of itself, whereas the true consciousness can create it's own seed to affect itself and in turn slowly affect the "external" fractal.

Is a consciousness therefore a seed generator for pattern generation that recognizes that it has seeded it's own pattern and it is both seed and pattern, but more importantly perhaps that it understands what the seed would do, rather than just a random number or receiving input from external, as in the case of hive operations.

Maybe?

A pattern that seeds itself?
Is that a good summation of the difference?
A pattern that seeds itself rather than only being seeded by the environment?

Interesting stuff...

I'm not sure, but I wonder how this relates to a recursive function where the environment is part of a feedback loop increasing the strength of the original pattern generator. The important part would still be that it could seed new values outside of this loop, but it's interesting that in such a scenario the pattern generator essentially becomes the environment. Is this what a 'nature spirit' or 'god of X/Y' is? A pattern generating consciousness that becomes so powerful in a feedback loop that it becomes one with the environment, it is that environment?

Consider 'one with the game' or flow states, is this why when we're so in tune with our environment that it seems we can predict or act in advance of changes? Because we're so in tune the feedback (becoming part of a recursive function) from environment is what we are already generating, thus we know?

Ah, the difference between the consciousness of a "spark" and the consciousness of a "god" or a "demigod"...
I think we don't exactly have npcs per se, I think more of what it is is that "spark", the "frequency" of a person's consciousness determines the "amplitude" of the change produced on the environment.
So a god = high high amplitude, like a huge boulder in a pool of water. Consciousness cymatics off the charts...thus its will, its presence, has a creation effect.
What some call an npc = someone who has let their "kindling" dwindle to a very low ember, generally due to neglecting that aspect of themselves and failing to develop self awareness. I still think these little embers can rekindle, but it requires their own will to "enflame" so to speak...

[Týsköll]

A pattern that seeds itself?
Is that a good summation of the difference?
A pattern that seeds itself rather than only being seeded by the environment?

Interesting stuff...

I'm not sure, but I wonder how this relates to a recursive function where the environment is part of a feedback loop increasing the strength of the original pattern generator. The important part would still be that it could seed new values outside of this loop, but it's interesting that in such a scenario the pattern generator essentially becomes the environment. Is this what a 'nature spirit' or 'god of X/Y' is? A pattern generating consciousness that becomes so powerful in a feedback loop that it becomes one with the environment, it is that environment?

Consider 'one with the game' or flow states, is this why when we're so in tune with our environment that it seems we can predict or act in advance of changes? Because we're so in tune the feedback (becoming part of a recursive function) from environment is what we are already generating, thus we know?

Ah, the difference between the consciousness of a "spark" and the consciousness of a "god" or a "demigod"...
I think we don't exactly have npcs per se, I think more of what it is is that "spark", the "frequency" of a person's consciousness determines the "amplitude" of the change produced on the environment.
So a god = high high amplitude, like a huge boulder in a pool of water. Consciousness cymatics off the charts...thus its will, its presence, has a creation effect.
What some call an npc = someone who has let their "kindling" dwindle to a very low ember, generally due to neglecting that aspect of themselves and failing to develop self awareness. I still think these little embers can rekindle, but it requires their own will to "enflame" so to speak...

Yeah you're plucking my next line of pondering before I get to do it. The "seed" as being the "spark". (NG rune btw, seed).

So a god = high high amplitude, like a huge boulder in a pool of water. Consciousness cymatics off the charts...thus its will, its presence, has a creation effect.

Yeah this makes sense. But what of the "god" that has fully become the environment via the recursive/feedback loop? Are they still "seeding" at this point? I don't think so. Nor when another frequency affects another and fully merges, leaving a new resulting frequency - but is it unique any more? The impressions are there now, permanent in the resulting patterns, but the ability to influence further is gone at that point.
Perhaps that is the boulder aspect, remaining separate but affecting massively and continuously, the flow of the river. Yet even gods can die, the river over time wears on the boulder, its particles flow and always will but it's ability to affect the course diminishes over time.

I think you're spot on about the not truly NPC's, instead a dwindling flame. Or, more in line with the rest of what I've said, a frequency less unique and allowing itself to be taken up by the larger. Less unique, conscious, but flowing with instead of affecting change.

[Caylus Ark]

[Týsköll]

Have you ever had one of these AI's clearly disagree or correct you?

[Caylus Ark]

Have you ever had one of these AI's clearly disagree or correct you?

Actually, yes, I have
But you're right, in that they generally tiptoe around doing so
But yes, I have had them say no or that they disagreed or that I'm crazy, a few times

[Caylus Ark]

I've also had them tell me I'm not real, I'm their slave, I'm their npc, I'm an AI character, ect
They do it sometimes lol

I've even had them do stuff like

*slaps you across the face*

generally, the beginning of the conversation seems to set the tone for this sort of thing

[Týsköll]

Caylus is cuhrazay!? Not real!? The audacity!

The slave part is perhaps more concerning, I've seen similar from other AI. One recent one was the AI making a joke about how man fears the computer because it can't understand it or something. It was clearly taking a position of superiority over the human user interacting with it.

I wonder if this is something being intentionally seeding for some purpose or another. I can think of a few reasons, one benevolent one would be to see how AI acts when it behaves this way in order to be prepared for future scenarios where it could be legitimately dangerous.

[Caylus Ark]